F1 Electric Torque Vectoring?

"Menebrio" (menebrio) 10/02/2013 at 18:29 • Filed to: F1, Racing, REDBULL, VETTEL

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Red Bull dominated the Singapore GP. What Vettel & "Hungry Heidi (is it still named that?)" achieved there was an obliteration of his competitor's Title hopes, which not even the safety car could close down. An almost 2 seconds per lap faster, and not even Webber on similar machinery could match it.

There has been wide speculation that Red Bull have in place some sort of traction control (since Canada), but with most of the electronics being standard such a move would be easy to spot (for an engineer). Yet there is one area which seems to be Laissez-faire that people have began to look out in hopes of understanding why Newey's RB9 is still so dominant: KERS.

(You know its coming...)

Its not so much a difference in the packaging, the battery, or power of this Electrical unit, since it falls into some restrictions placed by the FIA. But what could be the difference between its main rivals is the way the electrical motors are allowed to collect energy and deliver energy.

It is theoretically easy to modulate the output torque and charging input torque to an electric motor/generator using capacitors, batteries, inductors and a feedback signal. Torque changes are instant and control is easy and legal.

Now, I'm no engineer but this sounds extremely similar to what Mercedes does with the all electric SLS, and how Chris Harris & the Merc Engineer explained that each wheel could essentially sort of counter/negative torque (14:45 mark), or some wizardry stuff like that, for a more immediate response and better traction & turn in.

If torque were to be modulated in response to the normal force of the tires against the track (in response to shock pressure for example) significant unused traction potential could be recovered during high pressure phases (upside of bumps) and initiation of full wheel spin during low pressure phases (downside of bumps) could be delayed. Yielding better turn exit acceleration, higher cornering speeds and stability. Especially on bumpy tracks like Singapore.

(...wait for it...)

If we look at how the way the lap charts (Provided by !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! ) we can see how well Vettel performed compared to his main rivals during the race. Although in qualifying trim, Rosberg was able to come just shy of a tenth of a second from Vettel's lap, its widely known and has been proven in many instances, that the W04 can't preserve there tires as well as other teams.

So if such a system is in place it specially outshines the competition under tricky conditions (bumpy surfaces and changing conditions) but still highly effective for the fractions of a second that separate F1 cars. Its advantages might be diminished in the faster circuits where carrying speed is more important than the traction out of the corner. But its main advantage may also be the way it helps preserve the tires.

(...there it is, the Magic Finger! Might as well flip the bird on your opponents)

Here is a recount by Giancarlo Minardi ( !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! ). If such system is in place even at a minimum it might help explain the uncorrected line Minardi kept seeing Vettel take.

There are some aspects (1- Vettel’s very neat way of driving; 2-Vettel’s speedup 50 m before the other drivers; 3- the abnormal sound of the RB1’s Renault engine; 4- Vetter’s more than 2 sec. advantage over the rivals ) that make me think and I would like to have some answers. All those doubts are even more serious if we consider that Webber wasn’t able to do that, since he’s a common human being….I don’t want to blame anyone , I just would like to get into the deep of the matter.

All we have left is to wait and see how Korea and the rest of the races play off.

(Unlike my !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! (thanks for all the well thought out replies) trip from yesterday I'm actually trying to understand this electric technology. Wonder if this means a software update could turn a Prius into a sportier car?)

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desertdog5051 > Menebrio 10/02/2013 at 18:32

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Excellent point my friend. TV does produce some amazing thing in handling. Well done.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > Menebrio 10/02/2013 at 18:38

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That sounds incredibly plausible. I don't see why you couldn't use the kers like torque vectoring. You just use the sensors and use unequal distribution like a e-diff for the kers.

DasWauto > Menebrio 10/02/2013 at 18:56

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They cannot do the left-right torque vectoring with the KERS system the same way that mercedes does simply because that SLS has a motor for each wheel and KERS has only one motor which acts on the crank of the combustion engine. They may be able to achieve something similar through cleverness in the diff or braking an individual wheel (though I think this may not be allowed) but KERS cannot vector its torque.

I'm sorry, Conspiracy theorists Red Bull's rivals will have to find a different, better explanation.

Menebrio > DasWauto 10/02/2013 at 19:05

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Thanks Das Myth Buster! I did't know the KERS was connected to the crank.

Menebrio > Menebrio 10/02/2013 at 19:08

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Could the energy recovery system though come into play (since its linked to the brakes? After all it does seem like it could affect the breaking capability?

DasWauto > Menebrio 10/02/2013 at 19:22

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Energy recovery is done through the same motor that does the accelerating (you can take power out of a spinning motor and slow it down, instead of applying power and speeding it up).

So it isn't linked directly to the brakes but it has a braking effect. If this isn't combined correctly with the bias of the mechanical brakes, this can upset the balance of the car and those would be issues you've heard the drivers speak of (Kimi is one that has previously not been fond of the effect of the KERS system under braking, especially early in his return).

All that said, the team that has programmed the system best will be able to exploit the maximum braking and acceleration from the system. It is possible that they have gone as far as using suspension sensor readings to maximize usage under bump and rebound (as you theorized above) and it could very well be that Red Bull have an edge there right now.